Such a thoughtful, thought-packed piece, Paul. It's a lot to absorb in one sitting. About Grandi I have my doubts--he often seems like a simple provocateur, a publicity hound in other words. Some of what he says (about carbonara, for instance) makes sense, other parts just don't make sense. On tomatoes, e.g., San Marzanos, few would trace them back to the "King of Peru" but there's strong evidence that they were known and used in southern Italy in the 17th century. There's a great piece by the late Rudolf Grewe in an old Journal of Gastronomy--I will try to find it and maybe repost the whole thing on my Substack. It's too valuable to lose. And then on tinned tomatoes vs. fresh: of course fresh is always better but for many of us who don't live in tomato-able climates (like Maine) or who are unable to have a garden at all, tinned has to rule the table. I don't see any other way around it. And I love the pasta al pomodoro technique. Revolutionary and delightful.
But I'll have more to say on all these subjects in the weeks ahead. Thank you!
Thank you Nancy. for your good comments. Re Grandi, having read his two books and listened to most of his podcasts, I would say he is anything but a "simple provocateur", rather one who has studied the history of Italian food in depth in the larger perspective of Italy's evolution from the middle ages forward. That said, he is making the most of the minestrone his stirring up. On S. Marzano origins, I too doubted the Viceroyalty of Peru and quoted the one provided by the consortium as it is part of the cenni storici that includes the disciplinare di produzione. Just the same, I found found another source that has this tomato entering the Po Valley.
Pomodoro S. Marzano dell'Agro Sarnese-Nocerino
Da Ministero delle politiche agricole alimentari e forestali
"La Storia"
Il pomodoro approdò in Padania nel 1500 insieme ad altri tuberi e spezie dopo aver viaggiato nelle stive dei galeoni di Herman Cortés, conquistatore dell'impero azteco.
Venne accolto con grande diffidenza da regnanti, scienziati e uomini di chiesa che bollarono il pomodoro come un frutto malefico. Risale al '600 l'inizio della sua fortuna, grazie agli Estensi che ne fecero distribuire gratuitamente i semi ai contadini. Quando l'Europa era agitata dalla Rivoluzione francese, la rossa bacca già rosseggiava tra il verde degli orti delle colline parmigiane. Nel libro “Il pomodoro: una sapienza antica” si sostiene però che solo nel 1902 a Fiano, una località tra Nocera, San Marzano e Sarno, il “pomme d'amour” divenne S. Marzano.
What seems consistent among the versions of the story, anecdotal or otherwise, is that the ecotype was not verified until 1902. In any case, perhaps the article by Grewe in the Journel will be enlightening. I went through my old copies and can't find it. If you find yours please send.
I’ve yet to find anything in a can or jar, even the priciest San Marzanos, that can match the flavor of a homegrown tomato. That said, I’ve planted San Marzanos—or at least varieties labeled as such, on a few occasions. The flavor tends to fall short, imo, and I’ve always chalked it up to soil and climate differences. Maybe that’s the culprit, maybe not. I've had much better luck with Amish pastes - also meaty, low acid, and when not too ripe, also good slicing tomatoes. If there’s any complaint, it’s that they can sometimes verge on too sweet, which I guess is a problem most gardeners would welcome. By the way, I believe I first heard of the Amish paste from you, and now I’m curious about your 'shift' toward San Marzano.
Ben. The comparison I was making between canned and jarred has to do with the difference in tomatoes that are packed in tin and retorted vs homegrown tomatoes processed in jars in a boiling water bath. No contest. Fresh is a different matter. San Marzano tomatoes do not have the sweet punch of other varieties and I think this is so because it is a paste tomato with less gel (where the flavor is) and more "meat". Acid is lower as well which contributes to the perception. I have grown, or tried to grow, many types of heirloom tomatoes, some hybridized, and have boiled it down to a few that do well in my clay soils in the Berkeley Hills where summer temps swing on average between 55-72 F. My terroir, if it can be called that ,best supports "New Girl" (from variant "Early Girl" that Monsanto now owns the rights to and which for this reason I have stopped planting). The genetics of New Girl don't appear to be stable as I am getting fruits of all sizes and qualities. San Marzano tomatoes ,Kiros ecotype, do well in my garden. It may be because of the quality of my soil that is high in mineral content. There was afterall volcanic activity in the Berkeley Hills many millenia ago and my hillside still displays a lot of igneous rock. Who knows. I am thinking about getting my soil tested but so far am content to be a gentleman farmer. Vesuvius east erupted in 1944 spewing lava, ash and not doubt other stuff that is always mentioned in the literature around San Marzano tomatoes as an important addition to its fertile soils. I don't doubt this, but I don't think these tomatoes can't be grown elsewhere with similar properties.
Interesting take on sweetness and paste tomatoes, because Amish paste have those same traits - less gel, low acidity, and more meat, but they are always sweet from my garden. Whatever it takes, I suppose. Tomatoes are serious business for people with our last names.
Such a thoughtful, thought-packed piece, Paul. It's a lot to absorb in one sitting. About Grandi I have my doubts--he often seems like a simple provocateur, a publicity hound in other words. Some of what he says (about carbonara, for instance) makes sense, other parts just don't make sense. On tomatoes, e.g., San Marzanos, few would trace them back to the "King of Peru" but there's strong evidence that they were known and used in southern Italy in the 17th century. There's a great piece by the late Rudolf Grewe in an old Journal of Gastronomy--I will try to find it and maybe repost the whole thing on my Substack. It's too valuable to lose. And then on tinned tomatoes vs. fresh: of course fresh is always better but for many of us who don't live in tomato-able climates (like Maine) or who are unable to have a garden at all, tinned has to rule the table. I don't see any other way around it. And I love the pasta al pomodoro technique. Revolutionary and delightful.
But I'll have more to say on all these subjects in the weeks ahead. Thank you!
Thank you Nancy. for your good comments. Re Grandi, having read his two books and listened to most of his podcasts, I would say he is anything but a "simple provocateur", rather one who has studied the history of Italian food in depth in the larger perspective of Italy's evolution from the middle ages forward. That said, he is making the most of the minestrone his stirring up. On S. Marzano origins, I too doubted the Viceroyalty of Peru and quoted the one provided by the consortium as it is part of the cenni storici that includes the disciplinare di produzione. Just the same, I found found another source that has this tomato entering the Po Valley.
Pomodoro S. Marzano dell'Agro Sarnese-Nocerino
Da Ministero delle politiche agricole alimentari e forestali
"La Storia"
Il pomodoro approdò in Padania nel 1500 insieme ad altri tuberi e spezie dopo aver viaggiato nelle stive dei galeoni di Herman Cortés, conquistatore dell'impero azteco.
Venne accolto con grande diffidenza da regnanti, scienziati e uomini di chiesa che bollarono il pomodoro come un frutto malefico. Risale al '600 l'inizio della sua fortuna, grazie agli Estensi che ne fecero distribuire gratuitamente i semi ai contadini. Quando l'Europa era agitata dalla Rivoluzione francese, la rossa bacca già rosseggiava tra il verde degli orti delle colline parmigiane. Nel libro “Il pomodoro: una sapienza antica” si sostiene però che solo nel 1902 a Fiano, una località tra Nocera, San Marzano e Sarno, il “pomme d'amour” divenne S. Marzano.
What seems consistent among the versions of the story, anecdotal or otherwise, is that the ecotype was not verified until 1902. In any case, perhaps the article by Grewe in the Journel will be enlightening. I went through my old copies and can't find it. If you find yours please send.
Sorry Nancy, I meant to attach:
http://www.agricoltura.regione.campania.it/tipici/pomodoro_sanmarzano.html
I’ve yet to find anything in a can or jar, even the priciest San Marzanos, that can match the flavor of a homegrown tomato. That said, I’ve planted San Marzanos—or at least varieties labeled as such, on a few occasions. The flavor tends to fall short, imo, and I’ve always chalked it up to soil and climate differences. Maybe that’s the culprit, maybe not. I've had much better luck with Amish pastes - also meaty, low acid, and when not too ripe, also good slicing tomatoes. If there’s any complaint, it’s that they can sometimes verge on too sweet, which I guess is a problem most gardeners would welcome. By the way, I believe I first heard of the Amish paste from you, and now I’m curious about your 'shift' toward San Marzano.
Ben. The comparison I was making between canned and jarred has to do with the difference in tomatoes that are packed in tin and retorted vs homegrown tomatoes processed in jars in a boiling water bath. No contest. Fresh is a different matter. San Marzano tomatoes do not have the sweet punch of other varieties and I think this is so because it is a paste tomato with less gel (where the flavor is) and more "meat". Acid is lower as well which contributes to the perception. I have grown, or tried to grow, many types of heirloom tomatoes, some hybridized, and have boiled it down to a few that do well in my clay soils in the Berkeley Hills where summer temps swing on average between 55-72 F. My terroir, if it can be called that ,best supports "New Girl" (from variant "Early Girl" that Monsanto now owns the rights to and which for this reason I have stopped planting). The genetics of New Girl don't appear to be stable as I am getting fruits of all sizes and qualities. San Marzano tomatoes ,Kiros ecotype, do well in my garden. It may be because of the quality of my soil that is high in mineral content. There was afterall volcanic activity in the Berkeley Hills many millenia ago and my hillside still displays a lot of igneous rock. Who knows. I am thinking about getting my soil tested but so far am content to be a gentleman farmer. Vesuvius east erupted in 1944 spewing lava, ash and not doubt other stuff that is always mentioned in the literature around San Marzano tomatoes as an important addition to its fertile soils. I don't doubt this, but I don't think these tomatoes can't be grown elsewhere with similar properties.
Interesting take on sweetness and paste tomatoes, because Amish paste have those same traits - less gel, low acidity, and more meat, but they are always sweet from my garden. Whatever it takes, I suppose. Tomatoes are serious business for people with our last names.